Beiträge von sprucegoose

Relay

From the local BMW garage it was about £22 including Vat. Quite a lot, but the electrical manual and a few test wires ensured that I was 100% sure that it had failed before I splashed out. The relay is "K52z" in the diagram.

ESSENTIAL Electrical Manuals

Just a reminder that our US friends have a great library at wuffer.net with public domain electrical troubleshooting manuals available for download. The freedom of information in the USA means that this information has to be available to everyone. I don't think Tom will mind if I publicise two particular volumes:

http://wuffer.net/MyFiles/ETMDRM.pdf
http://wuffer.net/MyFiles/ETM95.pdf

I have saved myself hundreds of pounds in servicing costs in the past two years, spectacularly, as many will recall, identifying a niggling ABS/ASC problem which turned out to be the ECU (still 100% serviceable on that one BTW). The labour cost to identify that problem, the cost of the part and then more labour to fit it would, I am sure, have cost me in the region of £1,500 at my local dealer where labour is over £160/hr.

Another relative trivial one a couple of months back was identifying a failed relay for the headlight flasher that powers the fixed driving lamps. But even that at a dealer would have been an hour's labour I reckon.

Thanks again, Tom.

Thanks for the comments. They're coming Monday morning to fit it at my place - hope it doesn't rain. Will try to get some pics showing where the problem was.

Autoglass not so bad...

As a last resort I wrote to Autoglass Customer Service at head office, pointing out that if I'd had the glass fitted by BMW, it would have come with a 2-year parts and labour guarantee. Also, that because it had failed so soon, it was plausible that they'd nicked it during the fitting process and so faulty workmanship couldn't be ruled out. Also, that no-one mentioned anything to me about it only having a 12 month parts guarantee.

Seems to have hit the mark. Got a call on Monday offering to fit a new rear screen free of charge, with another 12-month parts guarantee.

Can't do better than that, I'd say!

Lloyd, yes I think thats my problem. Where was the joint that you soldered? From the outside all I can see is the foil strip between the glass so nothing to get at there. There is a joint in the inside where the ribbon cables are bonded to the glass - Would that be where you did yours?

BTW, 8tech, don't be so quick to dismiss autoglass. This was an OEM part and I know that cos I saw the box it came in!

Went to Autoglass today. Sadly, parts are only guaranteed for 12 months (installed 08-2007) so I have to find a way to fix this myself. We pulled back the seals and, from the outside at least, the edge connectors look fine, so it has to be where the edge connector is soldered/bonded to the supply wire on one side of the glass. They advised against removing the glass as it is glued in place and any breakage would be my risk. One good thing to come out of it is confirmation that my bitumen sealing attempt has survived two years of weathering with zero moisture penetration, no corrosion and no milkiness. So it still looks geat - just doesn't demist!

Windows had it....

Thanks. As you said, I did indeed find 14.2V (engine on) across each set of supply wires once I'd worked out which wire was which. So I thought, why not make it easy and just switch the top and bottom supplies? Problem identified in one: bottom still gets hot but top doesn't.
To be double sure, then checked the impedence across the window: 2.3 ohms at the bottom - open circuit at the top. Sadly, this means the window is knackered and its less than 2 years old. Will post how I get on with Autoglass. Should be interesting....

Hello again everybody. Remember that new rear screen I put in 2 years ago? Well, all my efforts at sealing the edges were successful and no delamination, so far....

However, the entire top section has just stopped working - totally cold. Pulled off the interior C-pillar trim to find all the gubbins behind and in parallel checked the wiring diagram. There are actually two equal-sized matrices in the glass, top and bottom, with the two separate blocks of fine wires running in parallel between four edge connectors, an upper and lower on each side..

The edge connectors have a +ve wire on one side and a -ve wire on the other, giving four wires that then go to two oblong-shaped control thingies, one in each pillar. Obviously my problem can be narrowed down to the two top wires, but I'm at a loss to know how to test for voltages and continuity as I suspect some voltage regulation and/or step-down is going on in the "controllers". Has anybody ever got into the nitty gritty on what impedence there should be across the matrix? Or what range of voltages should be present on the supply wires?

I'd be grateful for any small tidbit of information that helps me to isolate the window (Lifetime Autoglass warranty here I come!) or indeed the car wiring at the faulty bit.

Cheers

TT
Sorry to hear the news re the ECU. When I took mine off it too was drizabone with no moisture on the floor but had still managed to become corroded inside. Pre the decision to send it to Rochester, I asked the local dealer about "borrowing" one to test. They said it wasn't possible as it had to be coded to the car to work- and to do this I would have to buy it first! A grand just to test a theory? Mmm.

John

PS: coming up to 2 years and the BBA reman'd unit is still working 100%.

On a long run at 75mph average I saw a clear 10% improvement to 33mpg when I switched from "normal" 97 super to Shell V-power. The M62 definitely likes the 99 RON. As an aside, any deisels out there? My Toyota 2.2D returned 47mpg with cruise control on at 70mph when filled with normal Shell. Then I filled up with BP Ultra (by mistake as it was 5p dearer) but only saw 44mpg on the reverse trip doing the same speed. Now its back on Shell and pootling around the lanes its back up to 38.5 versus 35mpg with other brands. Has anyone else seen this phenomenon with Shell fuels?

Arnie
Just had some work done and the car has come back with the radio asking for the code. Somebody had thoughtfully written it in the radio operating manual, but its not the right number. The unit is the standard Business radio/casette with a six-pack CD player in the boot. From this earlier thread I gather that I need to remove the unit, locate the serial number from which a dealer can provide the correct code. Can you confirm that its a "BMW" dealer that you are talking about......?
Cheers
JFS

Zitat von TallTony;57149

Maybe a ladder fell from the roof of my garage or whatever, I cant remember..... ;-);-)

I am with Tesco Insurance by the way.

Tony, there's usually lots of artics parked down at my local Tescos. It appalls me to think how easy it would be for someone to reverse right under a tail-gate and smash the rear window on a low car. I think I'm going to have to write to my MP...


JFS

Rear screen

Argo, Hi, I think that might have been me. The new OEM part I got from Autoglass had only a dry rubber seal hence there's nothing to stop moisture getting to the fine elements where they join the edge connectors. Its a weak design, plain and simple. In the end I found that a generous application of black bitumous underseal was the best solution. I lifted the seal an inch or so at a time (you only need to do the vertical edges), pushed the sealant underneath to completely envelope the edge of the glass and fill any cavities. Then let the rubber fall back into position and removed any excess to make a neat, flexible and water-tight seal. As for repairs, its not going to work on two counts. First, cosmetics: once the laminate has been penetrated, there's just no way back to clear glass. But worse, this problem is normally accompanied by chunks of the heated screen not working due to corrosoion of the fine wires in the glass.
SG

I had this when I bought mine 18 months ago. I followed the maintenance manual and found that the tin lid is a doddle to take off, being attached along the sides by just 6 Torx 25 set screws. It cost £100 to have it dressed and re-sprayed and then a replacement edge seal added another £40. Worth every penny. Don't know how you stop it happening again though...

Smudge
On a 1997 Ci Sport the 2 relays K94 and K95 are situated in a box on the LHS (looking forwards) near to the bulkhead. They are coloured pink as original OEM parts. The performance of these 2 identical relays can be checked easily but for my money they are not your likely culprits. (If you have read the thread I quoted earlier, disregard any enthusiasm on my part about the significance of these relays). If you haven't read that thread, I recommend that you do so, because all of the other tips, mistakes and discoveries that I made (with the contributions of other, more qualified members) are contained therein. For me it was a question of whether or not I wanted to continue pursuing a series of "intelligent guesses", or find the root cause of my problem once and for all. I chose the latter course.
SG

There has been much written about this already - a lot of it by me just over a year ago when my own problem surfaced. There had been many helpful comments posted on the site already, but to be honest, this area is so complex and there are so many potential causes, that I felt that it needed a methodical approach. Someone also suggested to me that I check the wheel sensors. Sounded like a good idea, but I now know that this is a filthy and significant mechanical undertaking - and then, even when you have got to each sensor you have the problem of knowing whether and how it is failing. How do you test a sensor, for example? You could easily waste masses of time cleaning or changing all four sensors and then have the miserable experience, as many have, of finding that the problem is still there when you turn on the ignition. Alternatively, I could show you how to check all four sensors - and all the wiring to them - in less than the time it takes to make a cup of tea. And without getting your hands dirty!

As I crawled through the labyrinth of technology that is the Bosch 5.x ABS system, more than once I thought I'd found the solution:- the infamously incorrect "Eureka" moment for me was relays K94 and K95, which I honestly believed had been under-specced after a long conversation with a Bosch engineer... still smarting from that one! But in the end, with the help of the many useful suggestions I received from other members, I did get there. The faulty component was finally positively identified, was sent for reconditioning with a 2-year guarantee and has worked perfectly ever since. It was my ECU!

http://www.8er.org/forum/showthread.php?t=4707

Good Luck.

Going going gone

Looks like a chap from Ireland snapped it up for £7299. Pretty good deal if the car's genuine.

Good luck

TT
Stating the obvious, the 2 diagrams above correspond to the test as described and should be all you need to visualise what you are actually doing. Basically its all about proving the 10 individual wiring paths branching from pin 87 (hole 2) of Relay 95 (switched +ve supply) and the ECU (which activates valves by providing the earth).

I checked wuffer and the 1995 electrical manual (where these diagrams came from) is still there at http://wuffer.net/MyFiles/ETM95.pdf I thoroughly recommend it - but Tom's cleaned up the database and it might be necessary to re-register if you haven't been there for a while.

Look forward to hearing again when you have found what the problem is.
J

PS - Scratch that comment. I just clicked on the link to test it - and it goes straight there!

Electrics 1995 onwards

TT
These are the pages that correspond to your car and match the directions above. If you haven't got the entire electrical manual, I think it may be on wuffer....
J

Found It

Tony
Just scanned the onld thread on this and found my original test notes...:

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Here's my attempt to prove the wires and all of the solenoids in the Pump unit in one go.

1) Make sure the ignition is OFF and remove relays K94 and K95 .
2) Remove the ECU connector from the ECU and have a diagram of the connector handy.
3) Bypass the K95 relay socket to short hole number 8 (connects to pin 30 of the relay) to hole number 2 (connects to pin 87 of the relay). This action supplies +ve current to pin 15 of the Hydro Unit, hence all 10 valve solenoids are now receiving a positive PD (no current though, as the ECU provides the earths)
4) Stick the -ve probe of a multi-tester into a suitable earth in the ECU connector block (28, 29 or 55 should all be good earths) and, one by one, check the voltage received on the following ECU pins:
2 - Left-front IN valve
33 - Left-front OUT valve
54 - Right-front IN valve
27 - Right-front OUT valve
52 - Left-rear IN valve
25 - Left-rear OUT valve
6 - Right-rear IN valve
34 - Right-rear OUT valve
49 - Plunger valve (aka cross-over valve)
26 - Pressure intake valve
5) Record the voltages for each of these 10 pins, which should be fractionally less than the battery voltage at the time of the test.
6) Now remove the short across relay socket K95. (easy to forget !)
7) Connect one probe of the multi-tester into hole 2 of the relay socket housing K95 (where pin 87 goes) and then test the resistance of each of the valve solenoids, as follows:
Using the same pins at the ECU connector, measure and record the internal resistances. On both my Hydraulic Units I obtained the following readings:
2 - Left-front IN valve: 9.0 Ohms
33 - Left-front OUT valve: 4.7 Ohms
54 - Right-front IN valve: 9.0 Ohms
27 - Right-front OUT valve: 4.7 Ohms
52 - Left-rear IN valve: 9.0 Ohms
25 - Left-rear OUT valve: 4.7 Ohms
6 - Right-rear IN valve: 9.0 Ohms
34 - Right-rear OUT valve: 4.7 Ohms
49 - Plunger valve: 9.0 Ohms
26 - Pressure intake valve: 9.0 Ohms

I'm now pretty confident that the wiring between the ECU and Hydraulic Unit and back again to the ECU is OK but as I shall only know when the ECU comes back from BBA-Reman that the problem has gone

---------------------------end of insertion----------------------------------------

Anyway TT, that was what worked for me back then. IMHO (and some of us have got the scars to prove it I seem to remember!) the relays might be a bit of a red herring. For your reported faults, its the currents and resistances on pins 49 and 26 that need checking. What you can also do, which we did in Zeals with the hydro unit removed, is earth these same pins to physically activate any of the valves. For this additional test with the hydro unit in situ on the car, set up the test wiring as descibed in steps 1) to 3) above, so that the hydro-unit is positively powered and then just earth pins 49 and 26 of the connector in turn. The click, more like a slight pop, is quite noticeable when you've got your head under the bonnet.

IMHO, if you run these tests and can prove a) connectivity, b) correct resistance and c) successful activation, then you can look confidently at the CPU. If not then you can look somewhere else. I'll dig out the wiring diagram that I used and post that later. Best of luck.

J