Key stuck / Auto shifter possibly related

The "shift-lock" feature, implemented as a result of Audi 5000´s overseas racing towards pedestrians and killing those seemingly on their own accord, requires that one of your feet is operating the brake pedal before the gear lever can be moved out of position "P". The only connection between any of your feet and the car´s electrical system is a push button right behind the brake pedal linkage which itself operates a so called double switch. This purpose of this switch is manifold:
it makes your brake lights glow!
it instructs the cruise control unit to hand over the car´s accelerator to the driver
it energizes the solenoid blocking the gear lever in "P", thus freeing the lever.
it checks itself (that is the second part in "double" switch)

In case this switch (either of those) is malfunctioning it may result in any of the above features not working. The switch itself can be diagnosed.
The operation of the solenoid, pulling a bolt out of the gear levers base, is visible when pressing the brake pedal. Not sure though whether you will have sufficient visuals without removing the entire center console or already when the gear lever surround has been taken out.
----

ad 4: if in fact that bowden cable is found to be the culprit you will, in the case of replacement required, need access on both end points which also includes underneath the steering column. Removing those plastic bits is rather easy - apart from two plastic screws top and bottom the two halves are only clicked into each other. Bit fiddly with the EWS control unit (maybe only for the top part)

ad 5: nicely describes the likely required steps if full access to the stuff behind is required. Reads a lot more complicated as it will turn out. MID is a bit troublesome to release - has a huge, slightly elevated and flexible but rather invisible area (ca. 10cm x 1cm) which needs to be pushed upward in order to remove the MID.

ad lastly: the pin thing: only for M60/M70 and not Steptronic

BTW: from reading through your report it did not appear that both problems occur simultaneously (quote: "they do not manifest at the same moment"). The simultaneous occurence definitely speaks in favour of that bowden cable thingy. Checking the solenoid´s proper operation nevertheless is not a big deal.

Cheers
Reinhard

Zitat

1) Steve - when you write "I suppose if you remove the bowden, the part in the shifter would remain in the locking position." - i'm not sure what the logical conclusion you make here . Does this mean the bowden cable MUST stay in place, no matter what?

I have not yet disassembled a shifter so I'm just trying to "imagin" how this locking can be done.
As a car sits most of the time unused I would create a mechanical solution that locks the shifter in P without stressing any of it's part.
So some sort of a pin is pushed in to a hole by a spring. As long as the car sits unused, the locking parts would have no tension.
When you turn the key, the cable pulls this pin out against the spring. (So there is some tension here).
As I say, I never disassembled such a system and so I'm only guessing.
If you would remove the cable, you would have to also remove the locking parts (in my simple example, the pin and the spring) and permanently disable the locking mechanism. I don't know if this can easily be done.

3)
I think Reinhard is referring to the fact that you also have to press the break pedal to move the shifter out of P. So there is a solenoid as well as a mechanical cable responsible of the locking. (They could have used the ignition key - which is just a switch at the end - to also disengage the lock. The physical connection via cable is probably added security).

4)
The lower steering column cover covers the other end of the cable, so if you wan't to investigate on this end, it has to be removed.

5)
Removing only the shifter cover will give you access to the shifter. Removing the complete middle console will give you a more comfortable access to the shifter and also to a large portion of the cable.
I think for quick assessment it is enough to remove the shifter cover only.
Removing the whole console is also not a big deal. If I remember correctly Number 6 on that list will only work if you carefully pry out (with a plastic or wooden stick) the long covers housing the switches (ASC, seat heating, etc). Then you can disconnect the switches.

I have an M62 (5HP24) with a different shifter shape (like a mirrored L). I never remove the boot itself as the boot and shifter knob fits trough the hole easily.
I'm not sure that it works also with the M60 (5HP30) but you could give it a try.
I also don't have a mechanical gear indicator so I can't tell you exactly about the little pin but I'm quite sure that you have to disconnect this pin if you want to remove the cover.

Cheers,
Steve

Edit: no one can beat lightning Reinhard...

Did a bit of digging - the bowden cable referred to above is the so called "interlock" cable and can be adjusted. Here is a picture along with adjustment instructions taken from the likely quite similar steptronic console of an E46.
8er.org/forum/index.php?attachment/25907/
Will try to find the same for an E38 740 where it ought to be identical to the M62 8er.
Underneath the circled "1" you can see the shift-lock solenoid.

As Steve points out there are two locking mechanisms. One solenoid operated bolt locking the lever in "P" as long as brake pedal is not pressed and the bowden "interlock" cable linked to the ignition switch.

Cheers
Reinhard
----

Added: Not really a big surprise that the document I was hoping to find is located on Timm´s webspace - thanks for that
Adjust interlock E38

The scheme shown is the same as in the E46.

I think I'm completely wrong!
The cable seems to be only there to prevent you to remove the key without putting the car first in P.
So I't only locks the key in the ignition and not the shifter. For that, only the solenoid seems to be responsible.
I found a thread in the 7 series forum where one wanted to be able to move the shifter from P in N without the key.
They simply disconnected the cable and they had no problems after.
Sorry for my previous assumptions, I think you can disconnect the cable on the shifter side an the car would still operate.

Cheers,
Steve

Zitat

1) Are we quite sure the car remains safe and functional even without the cable linkage from shifter to ignition?

You must be aware, that without the interlock cable, you can remove the key without putting the car in P.
That means the car could start to roll if you park on a hill and forgot to put it in P.
The Link I found in the 7 series forum states that after removing the shift interlock the car remained safe (except the above exception).

Zitat

2)...

The solenoid has in my opinion no connection to the shift interlock, so it remains completely intact.
After starting the engine you should not be able to move the gear selector out of P unless you press the break pedal.

Cheers,
Steve

... ummm... but that is not REALLY a fix, right?

One could have tried the adjustment procedure first and if that failed still replace the cable @ less than 20 quid...
8er.org/forum/index.php?attachment/25908/
What about you getting a Philipps screwdriver along with a (maybe) 12mm nut and try to fix the cable in the recommended position?

Looking at the parts catalogue I am wondering whether cars prior to 9/96 would permit removal of the key outside of "P". Can´t imagine they did...

Cheers
Reinhard

Now, now
Did you try and remove the key, say in D?
If you can, then the bowden cable is no longer attached and you know what to expect.
If you can´t then it was fixed in the prescribed fashion.
Judging from the description posted above it is but a few minutes work to get it right in case of a misalignment.
Now stop sulking :
Cheers
Reinhard

You're sure Mr Whippy actually sells ice cream and isn't related, work wise, to Cynthia Payne?