Emissions

Going through the list of users having read the post, I see mostly German, French and Swiss members, but very few from UK...
I certainly do not plan to drive to London with an E31, but I am not overly surprised. When I bought my 840, it was also carrying a sticker on the windshield allowing access to the centre of Munich

The only way to move this forward is to contact TFL and ask if the 850ci is compliant as the original poster did as shown below:

https://www.bimmerforums.co.uk/threads/ulez.573578/page-2

"[FONT=&quot]Result!!![/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]I contacted TfL and after an extremely tortuous process they've confirmed my 840 is ULEZ-compliant - Hooray![/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Basically, you need to go to the TfL website, register with them and then start communicating. They will ask for a certificate of conformity from BMW, which, amazingly, I got from Customer Services which showed NOx emissions of zero for my VIN. You then have to send this certificate plus a full copy of your V5C registration document to TfL. This is tricky because their website download facility doesn't seem to work. So send as attachments to an email instead. Finally, they've just emailed me a letter saying I don't have to pay the ULEZ charge![/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Worth the effort!"[/FONT]

Zitat von Timm;152211

quoted: "which showed NOx emissions of zero for my VIN."

This is outright hilarious - go for it!

I would think it ought to read "not measured, ever" but certainly not "zero".

On average it appears that a car of the early 90s period belonging to the then valid Euro 1 emissions class would produce 650mg NOX/km which, if taken into account would be more than sufficient to only use it as a trailer for all times to come. I am pretty certain that the V12 will home in well above that averaged value.

Here is a bar graph (dated 2019) - all the red bar cars ought to be banned from inner city traffic (here Frankfurt) were NOX rules applied throughout the range. The best emissions classification one can have here for an E31 is "Euro2" - still a red bar in the graph shown below. I think that our rules are/were not as strict though as those imposed in London.

8er.org/forum/index.php?attachment/46155/

Luckily enough and strange as it seems, NOX rules over here only apply to Diesel engines and everything propelled by petrol is exempt for now. Also exempt from basically everything: all cars aged 30+ and carrying a "H" suffix (historic vehicle). Exempt for now! We can all make educated guesses that this won´t be forever.

My 2010 535d (Euro5) has exhaust pipes you could basically eat from - banned from various locations in Germany where Euro6 emissions are required. Many 2020 direct injection petrol engines are useful to harvest soot from the end pipes but may drive wherever they want. Sure, soot ain´t NOX but well, emissions nonetheless (particulate matter is another word)

I am nevertheless surprised that BMW would produce a "COC" document, the very existence of these has been categorically denied by Munich for as long as I tried to get one

Great news. Time for a E31 meeting spanning London Bridge!

Cheers
Reinhard

Zitat von reinhard;152230

...

Here is a bar graph (dated 2019) - all the red bar cars ought to be banned from inner city traffic (here Frankfurt) were NOX rules applied throughout the range. The best emissions classification one can have here for an E31 is "Euro2" - still a red bar in the graph shown below. I think that our rules are/were not as strict though as those imposed in London.

8er.org/forum/index.php?attachment/46155/

...
Cheers
Reinhard

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This is indeed intersting stuff...

Anyway, I tend to understand the situation like this: these numbers showed in your graph are just the legal limit values for the different Euro classes.
This won't imply, that one car actually emits this amount of NOx in real life. So if BMW says and certify that your car doesn't has NOx emission, then so it is... and you get a blue sticker

Zitat von Danilo;152241

...these numbers showed in your graph are just the legal limit values for the different Euro classes.

From what I understand these are numbers derived from model calculations but obviously related to real world values.
Real world figures seem to show for cars prior to Euro2 that the indicated numbers may even be exceeded by... a lot

Here is the source for the above graph. Apologies for the non-scientific journal

Here excerpts of a book with values apparently derived from measurements.

Quick summary translated (Deepl.com):
---Begin translation
Petrol engine

Let's take a petrol engine without a catalytic converter as the original state in 1985. In normal driving, it is generally estimated to emit about 1,500 to 2,000 mg NOx per kilometre. With a controlled, warm catalytic converter, on the other hand, the value usually drops to less than 100 mg, so this is the decisive step.

Unfortunately, however, this statement cannot simply be left as it is; rather, it must be supplemented by a number of important secondary aspects:

1) The older vehicles in the test (on new cars) showed many outliers towards the top. Despite the G-cat, four-digit NOx values were occasionally measured. The probable cause was thought to be sloppily programmed regulations outside the test cycle. Since EURO 1, this has often affected speeds above 120 km/h. In the case of even older cars with a US catalytic converter, on the other hand, the test cycle ended at 96.4 km/h, which is where a particularly large number of anomalies occurred. Over the years, the proportion and the amount of these outliers decreased considerably.

2) The 100 mg were not the end of what was technically possible. With each newer standard, emissions fell further and further in operation with functioning regulation. Cautiously moving current models (EURO 5) tend to fall into the single digits or right to the detection limit. In relative terms, therefore, emissions differ greatly within petrol engines with a warm G catalytic converter, but in absolute terms it is quite irrelevant whether one emits 10 or 100 mg. The crucial thing is that the 2,000 mg is off the table.

3) The petrol engines before EURO 3 (the ones with the 40-second lead time in the measurement) still have a hard time after a cold start. As a rule of thumb, you have to reckon with about a full kilometre until the catalytic converter has kicked in. Since EURO 3, on the other hand, it usually takes just a few seconds for the exhaust gas purification system to kick in.

Since the introduction of EURO 3, NOx emissions from petrol engines in real mixed traffic have been 100 mg or less. This should be a safe level for air quality.

In the case of our old cars, on the other hand, which are typically labelled EURO 1 or EURO 2, it is not easy to give a blanket figure for nitrogen oxide emissions, and in fact it does not make sense to do so. Depending on the length of the journey and the speed, a mixed calculation of warm phases (< 100 mg) and cold phases (> 1,000 mg) must be made, taking special account of any inadequate regulation. As an average value in mixed traffic, 500 mg for EURO 1 and 300 mg for EURO 2 can be assumed.
----- End translation

So.... if BMW jots down a big "O" it was probably meant to be read as "O"oooh we really don´t know

Reinhard

Zitat von reinhard;152244

...
Here is the source for the above graph. Apologies for the non-scientific journal

...

Shame on you!

Zitat von reinhard;152244

...
So.... if BMW jots down a big "O" it was probably meant to be read as "O"oooh we really don´t know

Reinhard

Btw... have a nice weekend, Reinhard!