CAN A 850 TAKE OUT A M3????

Hello everyone. First post. Love the E31 8 series.

No, the E46 M3 will out run it. For a start, the M3 is both lighter and has more power (252kW versus 220kW V12). Incidentally, my E63 650i coupe will also out run its successor, the 850i.

I'm looking for a late model 840Ci M62 engine, closest to the end of production life, say post 1997. I assume these are the most refined of the E31?

FASTER OR NOT

Dont agree with 650i ozman!!

I raced a 645 at the lights and i had 2 passengers in my 840 ci sport with the steptronic gear box and ive also raced just recently a 650 at knightsbridge in london. I didnt exactly leave the 650 or 645 for dust but neither did they. However i did have a better start bearing in mind that the 840ci sport does have the lighter 4.4 engine making it lighter and faster than the V12 and the steptronic definately makes a difference 0-60 and 0-100. The 840 ci sport has a different set up both in suspension and tuning set up.
Now the M6 ................ WELL THAT i cant even compare and will out run any 8 any day. And before other members start replying to my last and making comments like "what if the 8 was supercharged or turbod"" well quite frankly it isnt!! Then again the 8 was quite a fast car and still is for what it is. There is no comparrison in speed between the 8 and new M6.

Oh the 8 still looks more handsome though>

Because of the 8 series' large capacity + amount of cylinders it is anyone guess, unless someone has put it to practice. You would have to check the top end acceleration times. I think a CSI would easily out run it at the top end as i dont think the M3 is capable of more then 160mph, thats derestricted of course

Well guys.a stock 850 yes would be outrun by an m3.Mine personaly has the cats removed and has the 2 motronic and 1 eml chip (removing the 250 limiter)horsepower is over 400 now. So simply mine would humiliate an m3 and a 650 , in accelaration and top speed wich for my car is in excess of 300 km/h (6 speed manual gearbox) for that matter
M3's are nice city cars, I personally imagine it as a quick car to go to the supermarket but on the highways of america the autobahns of germany and the autostradas of italy the 8 is the king.
May the 8 be with you...

can an 850 out run......

to crazy8151
That is my man, yesssssssss

Let's get it clear. I'm talking about original, stock, unmodified 8 series. An original 840Ci M62 has 210kW of power, 420Nm of torque and weighs, what about ... 1900kg according to http://www.e31.net/navtechnik_e.html.

No way will that out run the E63 650i coupe, let's assume both steptronic versions. 270kW of power, 490Nm of torque, weighs almost 200kg lighter -period. Both cars are limited to 250km/h.

I'm not trying to start a war at all. Truth.

Both beautiful cars, which one you prefer is your right to express. I prefer the E63 but the E31 is very special and I'm looking to get one.

650IOZBOY

Dear all
Just having fun , ah ah ah , I am 50 years old , I drive my 850 on an average speed of 100 km / Hour MAX, since 1992 .
As you said both are beautiful cars no doubt about that , but we the 8 owners believes and hope and dream that our beamer is simply the BEST ... ah ah ah
Regards
JIMMYA

CRAZY 8

650I OZBOY If you like the new 650 so much then youre on the wrong web site mate. Further more I bet you my car park an 8 or a new six in a car park for a day and I bet you get more looks and attention on the 8 than the six. And half the people paying the attention would be six series owners. I think you forget that the 8 series is now a 17 year old design.
When you compared it to the old six back then it beat the six in every way. So picture a new 8 series in the making and I promise you that one day bmw will re-design. I guarantee you that the 8 will be once again BMW'S fLAGSHIP MODEL!! It still is which ever way you look at it coz theres only one 8 unlike the 6

I think you forget ................ 6 series?? 8 series well the numbers speak for themselves. The only 8 series i think that gives the new six run for its money is the alpina B12.

P.s totally off subject btu i raced an E39 M5 at the lights today guys and top my amazement I took lead ........... well only coz the road narrowed and guess who was on the narrow end LOL

Still it felt good coz the aim of the game is to stay in front.....

I'm not in the wrong website. I know exactly where I am. I am looking to purchase a 840Ci M62, in case if you didn't notice. That's why I'm here. I'm not a poseur, so I'm not interested in your bets.

The E63/E64 effectively replace the E31. There is no new 8 series in the design room. Different labels obviously but if you are that naive to not realise it, then I am very surprised. The 8 is a modern classic. I'm not here to bash it. I love it too.

I live with the times. The 8 is a great car in its day and is now a modern classic. Currently, the E63/E64 is BMW's flagship coupe/convertible.

Actually to be a direct replacement for the 8 Series, the new model would have to share the platform with the E65 7 Series as the E31 shares the E32 platform and dimensions in major portions.

The 6 series has always been a 5 Series derivative/complimentary model which should not be really considered to supercede the 7 series as BMWs Flagship. Oh I suppose that it could happen in some BMW Marketing types dreams

Terry Y,

While the E31 may have shared the E32 platform etc. as you suggested, luckily for us the E63/E64 does not share the platform with the E65 7 series, as you pointed out. However, your historical extrapolations in this case are not correct, IMHO. If BMW designed the E63/E64 based on the current 7 series platform and dimensions, it would be an over inflated coupe/convertible, and not even come close to its current handling characteristics. Why? Cars' dimensions are getting bigger, but large coupes cannot grow indefinitely in size like sedans. So I think sharing platform/dimensions instead with the E60 5 series makes good sense, which is already longer than the E31 (note that the width of the E63/E64 = width of the E31, both cars are at 1855mm). The E63/E64 is however longer than the E31.

Furthermore, the top of the line E63/E64 is the M6, which shares the same V10 with the E60 M5. But if BMW was to base a large coupe on the 7 series, then the V10 would not be powerful enough to pull a larger car, which means BMW would need to redesign a new engine just for the M6. Clearly, BMW would not do that for such a small volume car as the M6.

The economics have also clearly changed. The E31 was a sales disaster. Future large coupes would not be a "blank-cheque" exercise like the E31, but a car derived a lot from existing model lines.

Perhaps one day when the future 7 series is reduced in dimensions, maybe BMW might base a large coupe/convertible on that. Either way, flagship coupe will unlikely be a development exercise like the E31. This makes the E31 very special. It sure qualifies as a true modern classic, I think. (Maybe that is also another reason why BMW Marketing labelled the E63/E64 a 6 series, not 8, because to preserve the E31's classic status, even though there is a new replacement).

Terry Y,

By the way, your "little silver mistress" is beautiful!

Here is my car

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=140684

Actually when you were describing the overweight and underpowered 7 derivative you were describing the true niche of the 8 series.

Fast 'BAHNstormer with no real pretensions of being a Sports car except in looks. Just a Luxoboat with near SuperCar appearance.

The Sixes always had a sporty purpose but the 8 was for fat German bankers to beat the Airlines on straight roads from city to city across the Fatherland

On another note I don't see the 8 Series as a sales failure. It was produced from 1989 thru 1999 with at least one Individual model built in 2000.
Any model that runs virtually unchanged for that long is really hard to describe as a failure.
The price tags would be in the $150,000 US range today so it certainly wasn't aimed at a broad market segment in the first place.

The little Silver Mistress blushed and said thanks

Terry Y,

Quote: "Fast 'BAHNstormer with no real pretensions of being a Sports car except in looks. Just a Luxoboat with near SuperCar appearance. "

Times have changed indeed, and for the better.

The photos of your little mistress in Seattle Concours 1, 2 and 3 really do justice.

I had a standing start burn up with a M3 a few months back on the Penzance bypass. His M3 was a year newer than my 850i. On the first section, about half a mile he pulled ahead, but the torque in higher revs seemed to give me the edge. Skin of the teeth braking at the end roundabout though. I must get those disks replaced.
On the second stretch I think he had a better idea what he was up against. he pulled further ahead at the start, I was beginning to catch up when we tangled with other traffic and both pulled back.
A friendly respectful mutual wave and we each went our way.

The 850i is a car to cross continents in one single day! Is not a sports car!

Mine does both!

Well my 840 has just finished it's transition from Cruiser t Bruiser

Most of you know i've recently had a Supercharger conversion, well yesterday i got the car back after being fitted with bigger brakes, and a 3.91 LSDifferential.

The Brakes are awsome at last i can confidently brake hard,there is no tramlining , vibration or judder

The Diff came from an E34 M5, this has almost completly nailed the initial lag most 8 owners exprience when accelerating from standstill, and because the peak power from the coverted engine is between 3500 & 4800 revs i noticed how the revs were up the stock diff, no bad thing cause 3400 revs now equals 90 mph up about 600 on stock , however floor it at this speed and there is an endless surge of power with the supercharger just about to wake up and go through the motions

There are some draw backs though, Top speed could well be down to 135Mph but who's to worried about that should you want to keep your driving license Economy haha! is naturally down cause the engine is reving harder but over 200 miles i still averaged 25 MPG.

Yes i think i could try it on with an M3, but i'd lrt him go on his way after 80mph

looking at power to weight ratio alone a stock 850 has the sam P/W ratio as a Euro e36 M3 3.0 (286hp).
My 850 has been modified by Hartge and puts out a bit more (354hp) so it's in the same P/W ratio at the euro e36 M3 3.2 EVO (321hp) a E46 M3 with its 343hp is more powerful and lighter that the 8 so I dont believe the 8 stand a chance.
However the 8 has one trick up it's sleeve, the massive torque of the V12 engine. so in speeds exess of 200kp/h the 850 might be quicker, my car har the 250 limiter removed and will according to Hartge do 270kp/h or 174mph.

My theory is that a standard 850 will go atleast as fast as a e36 M3, marginally slower than a e36 M3 EVO and a fair bit slower than a E46 M3.
but as I said the higher torque of the V12 is the joker in this game.

As for the 6 series, this I believe is the only result of a planned model change that BMW cancelled at the last moment.
The plan was to differ the models.
The 1 series was introduced as a small 5 door car.
A 2 series was to be introduced as a convertible and coupè version of the 1 series.
The 3 series would only be a 4 door and the Touring modell
A 4 series was to be introduced as the Convertile and Coupè version of the 3 series.
The 5 series was to be a 4 door and touring, and the 6 series was to be the convertible and coupè version of the 5 series as it is today.

However they cancelled this at the last moment, and I think the 6 series is the only result of this strategy.