Instrument cluster not functioning correctly!

Zitat von sandwich;78735

The fuel low warning light is also out by the way. Not sure if that makes any difference but thought I had better mention it.

The reserve light is switched by the EKM. If the fuel tank contents on service menu 7 of the MID read below 10 liter the light should be on. If it should but isn't, the problem is very likely related to your cluster issue.

Zitat

Does the info go to the MID from the same source that transmits it to the cluster? eg Does all the info go from the EKM to the MID and cluster?

Both cluster and MID receive their information from the EKM, although not over the same bus. The MID is connected over the I-bus whereas the cluster has its own dedicated serial link. Nevertheless MID and cluster share the same data source, so if one functions properly the problem is unlikely in the EKM. Data corruption in the path that differs from that from the MID - EKM serial transmitter/receiver, wire and cluster serial transmitter/receiver - is also unlikely. In the digital world it usually either works completely, or not at all. Since the speedo functions normally, you can rule that out.

External power supply issues are also unlikely. In that case the speedo and several other warning lights wouldn't work either. The instrument cluster test would fail too. None of this is the case.

The erratic behavior which eventually lead to dead gauges may be caused by bad solder joints - as you already suggested in your first post. But it's unclear to me why the instrument cluster test then works properly. As far as I know the cluster test is just a test routine of the same microprocessor that reads the data received from the EKM.

Do trip and odometer still function properly? In case of an automatic transmission, are gear and program still displayed in the cluster?

Just wondering... Does the handbrake light work properly and does it come on for approximately 3 seconds when you turn the ignition on - even with the handbrake not applied? (the handbrake light is also provided by the EKM).

You can swap clusters for functionality.

Except for the EEEE mileage thing.

Im not aware of any issues long term of doing this.

However....I have the latest EKM (62.118.362.362), and not sure about any ramifications of the earlier EKMs.

Zitat von IcemanBHE;78968

You can swap clusters for functionality. Except for the EEEE mileage thing.

Thanks for confirming this!

Update: This seems to be incorrect. Tests performed by firebird and myself show that apart from the "EEEE" reading all gauges are inoperative on a used instrument cluster. That means you cannot test a used instrument cluster for functionality in another car.

Zitat

Im not aware of any issues long term of doing this.

The documentation mentions the pairing (coding) to the cluster or EKM happens only once after the first 8 operation hours. After that it can no longer code itself nor be recoded with external software, to pair up with a different cluster/EKM. Of course, considering the prices BMW asks for these items you better be sure before proceeding, but I have no reasons to doubt what's printed in the documentation.

Would there be any reason to think an earlier '93 850 EKM wouldn't be compatible with a V8 '97? I can certainly understand reluctance to adding a matched pair that's at 77,000 to a higher mileage car. But for testing purposes another single EKM should suffice, no?

I can guarantee you this....

An earlier EKM will not have 100% functionality in a V8 car.

Right now...I have a 91 850 cluster/EKM in my 95 840, as my EKM has a goofy fault causing a non-existant Trans Fail Safe error.

All of the mileage, fuel trims etc are goofy. (which can be changed with NCS)

Not to mention the tach redlines, hits the end, slams back and then takes off again when at about 6k RPMs. (Which may also be coded with NCS)

I also CANNOT see the EKM or EGS in the car with DIS/INPA, with this older cluster/EKM in the car. (Thus no coding with NCS )

The NEW EKMs superceed the older ones for functionality, but not vice versa.

Keep in mind the V8 cars had some changes to wiring, etc, etc not to mention no EML.

Thanks for helping clear that up Brian..... you're the first I've known that's done that particular combination. Now you've got me wondering.... many things were changed in '93, and I'd be curious to know if my later pair would exhibit the same behavior as what you have now.... only takes postage to see.

For the Op's purposes though we're only talking putting in the odd EKM to see if the cluster will fire.

Agreed.

But....IM SURE that the 62.118.362.362 EKM was made for the V8 cars specifically, and backwards to the V12. I know there is some internal diffs.

So....I suspect a V12 cluster/EKM WILL NEVER be 100%.

We can certainly try anything Randy. Im game.

But....Im on to a fix. I just need a donor.

Know you KNOW why Im specifically looking the the P/N above for my car.

62.118.354.460 it appears was used on the EARLY V8 cars as well.

But if Im correct....and I suspect I am.

These are the only EKMs that will function correctly in the V8 cars.

Above part was used until 9/94 and superceeded by 362.362.

IcemanBHE: I wrote this at bimmerforums.com a while ago, but according to the documentation EKM 62 11 8 362 362 (11/1993) was introduced for the M73 with steptronic transmission. Btw, there have been several other EKM revisions before this - 62 11 8 354 460 (not further specified), 62 11 8 354 443 (04/1991), 62 10 8 354 169 (10/1990) and 62 10 8 354 163 (the original, I guess).

Rev. I understand this....

But only the 460 and 362 EKMs were used on V8 cars.

The documentation mentions support for the M60 in EKM 62 11 8 354 443 (04/1991). It's possible this had nothing to do with the 840Ci but the 830i prototype. The 840Ci isn't mentioned until 08/1992 but it's unclear when EKM 62 11 8 354 460 was introduced. So, yes, it's very well possible the M60 840Ci requires at least this EKM revision.

The M62 is first mentioned at 09/1994, which is well after EKM 62 11 8 362 362 (11/1993) was introduced, so I can imagine BMW never used the M62 840Ci with an earlier EKM revision. It may work, but there could be issues. The connection failures between DIS/INPA and your EKM may be related to this.

Exactly my point.

I wold ONLY be using the 62.118.362.362 EKM in V8 cars as all the functionality is built in and can be programmed for the value differences......

And...can be read by INPA/DIS in the car....

I don't know if this helps but on a recent rebuild I had the speedo cluster out of the car for a couple of years, it had been nicked and with Jud's help I recovered it on ebay. I then paired it with a controller which was not the original and had it coded to work by my dealer. I realized the speedo did not reflect true lapsed mileage of the of the engine/car. I then recovered the original controller from the car, which had been in my stores for 4 years, paired it up and it worked perfectly and gave the true lapsed mileage of the engine/car, obtained from MOT records.
So in my case the 8 hour time out did not come into play. Why I wonder?
My very grateful thanks to Iceman and others who gave me the information on how to do it at that time.

Simple Peter.

Your EKM and cluster had already been "paired" for longer than the 8 hr limit.

This 8 hour limit is ONLY on VIRGIN new EKMs.

Understood, I was a bit confused thanks for putting me straight.

The acoustic sensor/output is the gong that announces warnings and errors. It's not required for normal operation, but the EKM will store error messages if it's disconnected or short-circuited. The instrument cluster should work just fine regardless of these fault codes.

By the way, since your last topic about this issue I've been experimenting with EKM modules and instrument clusters and found out ways to install used parts without ending up with the dreaded "EEEE" and keeping your VIN, coding data and correct mileage - just as if you replaced it with a brand new dealer part. I wrote an article about replacing the instrument cluster with a used part - Instrument cluster swap (no EEPROM programmer or soldering required - just a diagnostics interface and software). The other way around (EKM module swap) is possible as well, but at the moment still requires an EEPROM programmer. I hope to find a simple software based solution for this too in the future.

From your descriptions, I'd say your instrument cluster is faulty. With the new information and possibility to swap with used parts, I'd get a used cluster from a breaker and use my method to assign it to your car. I think there's a good chance you'll go into spring with a new used but working cluster