CB57062 - the hen´s teeth

  • Just came across a series of youtube videos by a guy going by the name "kraftwerkmod". These videos were taken at several Gaydon meetings throughout the years.
    Some cars I have been able to identify, some not.
    One that really sparked my interest is the Mauritiusblue H56NMO - according to the DVLA data it is an early 1991 850iA.


    Video link 1
    Video link 2


    All pictures below clickable for higher resolution!



    The interior of the car is quite intriguing and to me this comes as a big surprise. Here is why.
    At first glance it seems as if this interior was "nicked" from a CSi - it has the stitching on the door cards and a colour scheme which was named Silbergrau Hell N4SH.



    It might also be that of a late 840Ci Sport, only this colour combination is unusual for late production 8ers. The chrome plated door handle shows the telltale sign of a post 9/92 production car which H56NMO clearly is not.


    If it were so then you´d not have heard any comment from me - retrofits to suit the owner´s taste are nothing one needs to lose many words about. They happen and the owner is happy with it. :top:


    I can tell you though that this is not what it at first appears to be. :cool:


    What caught me is not immediately obvious and hence marked in the pictures below:



    The right arrows point towards a telltale sign for BMW Individual stitching on the dashboard, the left arrows towards the steering column covers show that those are of a colour differing from what we see everywhere else.



    To me this clearly is a sign of hitherto unheard of use of leather in RHD cars. Some late 840´s received a bit of a leather indulgement where the door cards/rear side panels and center console were fully clad in leather. These cars are quite easy to identify by their "abnormal" color schemes:



    More about numbers and destinations further below.


    ---
    Whenever something unusual, not to be found on the standard factory order options list, was ordered this would be processed through BMW Individual and either receive an order code S940, S944 or a tag Special Upholstery Z1XX resp. 9990 in early years.


    S940 Special Order is a generic option code used for pretty much everything that was not on the standard options list as for example PDC - Park Distance Control, whereas S944 was always tagged Retrofit by ZS where ZS is nothing else but the former BMW Individual company.
    This company merged with the early 90´s BMW Motorsport into today´s M-GmbH which is not only responsible for everything quick but also for everything Individual.



    Back in the day LHD customers had the choice to purchase one out of three complete leather packages which were sold as Stages 1 to 3.


    Stage 1 had leather covered dashboard, center console & door panels - 16.500 DEM (ca: 5.7k GBP in 1991)


    This means that in addition to what is shown above for the UK Sport 840 you´d be looking at such a stitching pattern on the dashboard:


    }


    Stage 2 leather included on top of Stage 1 all seat covers (upper, lower and back), steering column covers & the center console plastic parts (3x). - 20.600 DEM (ca. 7k GBP). The latter two went out of fashion post 9/1992 when several variations of real wood veneer became available.



    Stage 3 added the parcel shelf, headliner, A- & C-pillar covers and accessories there (sun visors, coat hangers, roof handle) - 25.750 DEM - 8.7k GBP



    In the very early times one could get even more... no pricing available but Individual made everything possible the customer was asking for.



    Post 9/92 Stage 2 was uprated with the parcel shelf and prices went down a fair bit. The last price for a Complete Leather Stage 1 interior was 9.600 DEM in 1999 (3.400 GBP)


    ---
    Whenever the term complete leather was used in the build data sheet of a RHD car it was in conjunction with a however: without leather covered dashboard.
    I had this theory that BMW never bothered to make the necessary sewing patterns.


    This theory withstood the times so far, but was only true according to the data at hand extracted from the BMW system. Especially in the early years of the E31 individual data can be missing when it comes to the options S940 and (the much rarer) S944. Seemingly the data exchange between the Dingolfing production and the M-GmbH in Munich was not entirely reliable.


    Here is an overview of the RHD cars which had that suspicious option S944:



    CB57383 is a Sultan of Brunei car and by now probably rotting away in the jungles of Borneo, CB57900 and CC88015 remain to be discovered.


    Having sifted through all data sheets of RHD cars this is the extended leather summary:



    CB57062, produced on Oct 31st, 1990 is very likely the car we´re looking at here. The car with the registration H56NMO was 1st registered in the UK on Jan 24th, 1991 and this, along with the visible options makes for a match with the build data for CB57062




    Apart from what was pointed out in the very beginning what else can be discovered?


    In the first picture one can see the "salvaged from another car" theory fall to bits



    The arrow here shows that the seat belt guide is of the material only in use until 9/92 and never used in a CSi or 840. The "facelift" models all had chromed seat belt guides.
    It is not entirely unthinkable that someone went to the lengths to completely dismantle two pairs of seats and rebuild them in this fashion but apart from the fact that there is no reasoning in it and a ton of work on top there still is much more to be seen.


    Passing the car another "classic" telltale sign for a leather clad dashboard can be seen:



    The arrows point at the beginning of a disaster which eventually will look like so:



    Leather, as dead as the cow might be, still has some life left in it and starts to dry and shrink upon constant exposure to the sun. As we all know the dashboard area can become uncomfortably hot in any car and depending on how well the glue clings to the dashboard skeleton, the shrinking leather will bend the structure before the sewing threads tear. Many leather covered dashboards and instrument cluster covers have been destroyed this way and the best thing one can do apart from nurturing the leather with conditioner is keeping the car dark and cold.


    Approaching the car from another angle a few more things can be highlighted:



    Arrow 4 points at that old-style seat belt guide. Arrow 2 shows that the rear seats are non-foldable which is a definite sign for a pre 9/92 car and hence also excluding the scavenger theory. Quite interesting are the headrest covers and rosetta which also seem to be of the leather covered type (arrows 3). The parcel shelf has a certain shine to it which one´d not see with a velour covered shelf. It is hence my assumption that this is also leather clad (arrow 1)


    Another glimpse of leather stitching was caught below:



    This shows that the back of the seat is also covered with the same type of leather amply used everywhere else.


    This now has to lead to the conclusion that the car pictured has a full fledged Complete Leather Stage 3 interior - I was unable to get good shots of the A- & C- pillar covers and did not see the headliner or the lower seat covers but I am certain that those will be leather covered too.
    The headliner was available in two variations. For your more than 2.000 quid you had the choice of Nappa or Nubuck leather where the latter one is of the soft type where one can in fact write upon with a bare finger.



    We´re not finished yet - a very tiny detail, basically invisible to the unsuspicious eye is marked below:



    Arrow 1 shows the stitching along the center console part. Arrows 2 and 3 indicate that the materials of the button panel and the surrounding bezel seem somehow different.. Also, just underneath the aircondition unit there is no sharp edge but an appearance of something rather out of shape (arrows 4). To me this is enough indication to believe that this part (and likely the other two center console inserts too) is also covered with (black) leather.


    Below pictures of how those three parts would look upon closer inspection:



    To summarize this report - some of you, those attending the Gaydon 2011 meet, have seen one of the rarest birds of the RHD 8er production. It can be likened to having seen this:



    To date this is the only known RHD specimen which was equipped with a Complete Leather Stage 3 interior and the likelihood to find more is extremely slim (CC88015, CB57383). It is the first RHD car ever to appear which has a leather covered dashboard, unfortunately with the same signs of old age that has been prevalent in similarly equípped LHD cars too.
    To date this is the 2nd oldest car with such an interior known (to me). BMW Individual offerings officially started in mid 1991 - CB57062 predates this by more than half a year. The oldest one, for sale in Germany last year is even another half year older and it is unclear why this is so :harhar:


    One tiny thing is left unexplained.



    I haven´t got the slightest clue but would opt for a retrofit.


    To whoever owns H56NMO - congratulations - what you have is nothing short of that one for the philatelists, take good care of it:



    That is then my 2p regarding that blue Mauritius


    Cheers
    Reinhard

  • Fascinating stuff Reinhard.
    I'd be interested to know - re: the tearing of the leather dash below the windscreen - what the owners options would be for fixing that damage and how much such a repair might cost.

  • Zitat von sandwich;95505

    Blimey.....I can say no more! I dont remember seeing that one at Gaydon 2011 but I can see Niftys beast in the background so I guess I must be there!


    Don't you remember Steve, you yawned and left early:laugh:


    Reinhard sent me video link No 2 shortly after informing me that I too, had been filmed at Gaydon. With the clip came a challenge and that was, to identify the aspects of this particular car that made it special.


    I ran the video over and over and apart from a few sleuth like observations, in short, I failed miserably.


    If only I had been sent video link No1 :naughty:


    Absolutely brilliant work again Reinhard. Thank you


    Cheers
    Graham


  • I was working in those days so obviously was feeling a little below par!

  • I've just got back after seeing Sherlock Holmes - A Game Of Shadows; even he does not have the deducing skills of Rienhard!


    It is the interior door handles that are inconsistent with an original build - and wouldn't the car have got to the customer a bit quicker as it was built to specification?

  • BBMatic
    No options - replace. Those dashboards and instrument cluster covers usually get damaged beyond repair. Time, heat and the incredible strength of shrinking leather gives the underlying plastic parts essentially a new form.


    Here are a few more pictures of damage done to other cars:




    Replacing means getting a new leather covered part. BMW is of no assistance here but there are saddlers/upholsterers that try. The replaced ones I saw usually were not up to par with the BMW Individual standards and longevity is something that remains to be proven. BMW today uses pre-shrunk leather.


    Timm
    Not sure what you´re referring to: the time between build date and 1st registration? This can be anything from days to years. According to BMW the production date in the build data sheet is meant to be the day the production was finished but this certainly does not apply to those cars that have anything Individual on them. In the few cases where additional data exists the "build date" can be weeks apart from the finishing line.


    For the final 8er CC67485 this data was retrieved:


    CC67485
    Production start03.05.1999
    BMW data sheet12.05.1999
    Seat installation19.05.1999
    Worker´s goodbye20.05.1999
    Farewell ceremony25.05.1999
    EWS Coding31.05.1999Factory information
    Customer delivery/1st reg28.07.1999


    This shows that production delays may have occurred which likely depended on the ability of BMW Individual for JIT delivery of the special upholstery items to the Dingolfing factory.
    ---
    The chrome plated door opener to the best of my knowledge was indeed unavailable in 1990/1991. The first instances where those appear are the early CSi prototypes in late July 1992. No instances before those are known to me. Hence my assumption that those must have been retrofitted to CB57062 at a later stage. The owner probably knows.
    Does anyone recognize the car and maybe know the owner?


    Cheers
    Reinhard

  • As it was parked in the BMWCC part of the Gaydon show he is most likely a member. If youre really keen to find out I expect they would be willing to forward an email to the owner
    Just a thought

  • Zitat von sandwich;95537

    As it was parked in the BMWCC part of the Gaydon show he is most likely a member. If youre really keen to find out I expect they would be willing to forward an email to the owner
    Just a thought


    I just called the Club HQ and would you believe it, they do not have any records of registration numbers so couldn't help. Their only suggestion was to put a post on the club forum and hope the guy responds!!


    As I said before the BMW club forum is about as active as the Carlsberg complaints department so I reckon it will be quicker to wait until Gaydon this year when we may bump into him again. I'm sure we spoke to him Steve but I cannot recall a name. I will however, make some further enquiries.


    Cheers
    Graham

  • Great post Reinhard!


    Sad to see those warped and torn leather dashboards. It looks so nice when new... :sad:


    Something I've been wondering about... Many of the BMW Individual parts are not even listed in the ETK. Does that mean none of these parts can be ordered if the original is worn or broken? Is there really no form of service/support towards BMW Individual customers? That would be a bit strange given the high price tag the original owners paid for it.


    Is the leather wrapped around a standard vinyl dashboard, or do the leather dashboards use different base parts? I can imagine that the leather, seams and stitches would make the parts too thick in some areas if it was wrapped over the standard vinyl. The center console wood trim, for example, also uses entirely different base parts than the plastic center console.

  • Great post Mr. Reinhard ;

    I love this car. Very valuable for me, I can say 18 years the excitement :)


    The owner could not be reached. We went to his house, and left a message to the mailbox. In addition to CC61719 I'll make an appointment next week. Involving the issues I will tell you, sir.

  • Excellent post! Seeing an interior with EVERYTHING wrapped in leather does give you the feeling of 'super car' even if now 8ers don't pull big $ in the market.


    Zitat von revtor;95554

    Is the leather wrapped around a standard vinyl dashboard, or do the leather dashboards use different base parts? I can imagine that the leather, seams and stitches would make the parts too thick in some areas if it was wrapped over the standard vinyl. The center console wood trim, for example, also uses entirely different base parts than the plastic center console.


    I'd also like to know the same as Revtor...i had seen leather wrapped dashes...but not the rest of the parts. I always thought once I'm "done" with most replacement things on the 8 I would want to do a leather wrapped dash for extra luxury.

    CB42366- 91 850i Brilliantrot/schwarz nappa
    CD00144- 94 CSi Hellrot/schwarz nappa
    :devilchilli:

  • I have only ever seen once a de-skinned, formerly leather covered instrument cluster cover and to the best of my memories it was just the standard issue cover with faux-leather.


    The trick used basically is skimming down the leather to way below normal.
    Normal hides are around 1.5mm thick. Those can be split further with special machines.
    This way you can still glue it to the normal surfaces without those becoming too thick.
    The thinnest type of leather I have seen was on those two covers surrounding the headrest arm and also on the two little plugs that hide the screws in the door handle (yes, those came covered in leather too...:roll:)
    This leather was more or less like a piece of paper and extremely delicate.


    Other parts like the headliner or the parcel shelf have leather thicknesses "as usual".


    Places with seams indeed have to undergo a special treatment where the leather underneath the stitching needs to be tapered out. Since all of this is done for cosmetical rather than practical purposes it does not really matter how strong it was made.


    I am but by no means a leather expert but rather known to incinerate stuff to find things out :laugh:


    Cheers
    Reinhard


    PS: Buying stuff that was handmade by Individual is probably not impossible but I have never heard of anyone being able to source a replacement part for something damaged going through BMW. I assume that within that large company and its mechanisms it just is much easier to say: NLA
    I know of one dashboard that was replaced and paid for by a BMW dealership - the replacement was undamaged but the way it was made very clearly showed that this was not produced following the standards set earlier on. I think it is safe to assume that the dealership just sourced a "pro" who made a good but not a perfect job. This can easily be seen at the curvature of the stitching and the thickness in the same area.

  • Zitat von reinhard;95675

    The thinnest type of leather I have seen was on those two covers surrounding the headrest arm and also on the two little plugs that hide the screws in the door handle (yes, those came covered in leather too...:roll:)


    Sick! In a very good sort of way!

    CB42366- 91 850i Brilliantrot/schwarz nappa
    CD00144- 94 CSi Hellrot/schwarz nappa
    :devilchilli:

  • To whoever has time at hand to bring back CB57062 to initial glory.


    Can be had for just under 5k GBP now:


    8er.org/forum/index.php?attachment/22281/


    From what we know today this is a one off. The only more or less only comparable RHD 840Ci Sport was sold some time last year within the blink of an eye for more than 4 times the money (admittedly with extremely low mileage).


    Cheers
    Reinhard


  • Wow, not a bad price considering the extra leather treatment!

    CB42366- 91 850i Brilliantrot/schwarz nappa
    CD00144- 94 CSi Hellrot/schwarz nappa
    :devilchilli:

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