Article on why NOT to Upgrade your car

  • Just Don't Do It: How Paying Good Money
    Lowers the Value of Your Car


    back to Mercedes SL500 or 190D or BMW 540i or R100S


    INTRODUCTION


    Collectors will pay you far above book value for your car, if it's in collectible condition. Collectible condition means it's original and has long-term value. This has nothing to do with its value to you as transportation today. "Book" values are for ordinary cars used for transportation. Collectors pay far above Kelly and Edmund's values. I sold my 1988 Mercedes 190D Diesel for about five to ten times its book value precisely because it wasn't much different than a new car, even though it had 160,000 miles on it. Not only did I get a high price, I had many more people disappointed that they had missed getting it after I sold it.


    The best thing you can do is leave your car alone, take it to the dealer for service, and save everything. Don't ever try to improve or modify anything, including even bad paint.


    A car is only original once. Anyone can do any number of restorations. An original is always worth more than a restoration.


    For transportation you may prefer some aftermarket customization, and go right ahead if you want bottom dollar for your car in 10 years. What you think makes your car stand out today will make it blend in with every other junky used car in a decade or two. A fully original car in top shape always stands out when it's exactly as it left the factory. Even an untrained eye recognizes it's originality, and having all the original parts adds to the impression of "showroom condition." I know it takes restraint to keep your hands off, especially with a performance car like a BMW, but your restraint will pay back handsomely in later years, as well as in your own appreciation.


    Start swapping things out and you wind up with a car half made in China or Inglewood, CA. Leave it alone and you still have a great German car.


    I cover what you should do, or upkeep, elsewhere. Here's what not to do:


    Drill Holes to Add Accessories


    As a collector I'm not going to buy your car if I have to replace the dashboard if your stereo store installer drilled through it to install a holder for your phone.


    Add Aftermarket DVD Navigation Systems, Radios or MP3 Players


    The people selling you your Pioneer DVD player or Alpine stereo take a lot of money from you and try to convince you you're upgrading. This may have been true in 1975, but not today. Today factory radios are the best head units you can get.


    it costs an awful lot for a collector to go buy the factory's original radio, and often they are no longer available.


    Worse, if you had to cut the dashboard you're screwed. No one wants a car with an abortion for a dashboard.


    Remember, collectors (and most people) want a new car; not one that you're personalized for you any more than they want your graffiti on their fence.


    Repaint Panels to Cover Scratches


    Don't touch the paint!


    If a collector wants to do a restoration he's going to do it his way and doesn't want to deal with any of your attempts at repair, deep detailing or restoration.


    When you pay good money to repaint even part of a car you destroy most of its value to a collector. This is because repainting is never as good as the factory's paint, and the more paint you put on a car the more work it is to do any other restoration.


    Factory paint is usually a dozen layers of primers, base coats, color coats and clear coats. These are applied as electrostatic powder coats and baked at around 1,500 degrees to a rock hard finish. The factory paints your car before almost anything is attached, otherwise they couldn't bake it this hot. Electrostatic painting means the paint is vaporized around the shell of the car and attracted to your car with an electrostatic charge, allowing a wonderfully smooth and even finish. Because there's nothing but metal and paint the whole thing can be heated super hot to effect complete chemical changes to whatever is applied. Because of this factory paint is shiny everywhere without needing polishing.


    Repaint, even at the finest shops, is repaint. It's simply sprayed on in a couple of coats and then not baked, but possibly heated to 350 degrees to speed curing.


    Repaint can look great for several years. The problem is that it won't hold up for decades for the collector as factory paint will. As a collector I'm going to pay someone else top dollar for their original car, not you for your repaint.


    Chrome Your Rims


    Not only does it scream "alteration," chrome peels of in a few years. If you chrome your rims at great expense to you, the collector now needs to pay $700 each to buy original rims from the manufacturer. Leave these alone!


    Replace Your Rims


    Even worse, replace your factory rims with some off-market ones from some catalog.


    You're out even more cash, and the collector has no choice but to have to go buy a new set of original rims.


    Add a Gold Kit


    Gag. These are always in bad taste. Now the collector needs to replace everything you messed with, and the gold peels off anyway.


    The real reason these always look so hideous is that no one ever does a complete job. People will gold some emblems, but skip expensive parts like the door lock cylinders, window trim or headlights. There is no "kit" for an entire car; kits just cover some easy basics and forget the other half of the car like the rims. People wind up with a car 3/4 in gold and 1/4 in chrome, and it looks like the abortion it is.


    If you can do the whole car, from headlights to the entire wheels, in gold, go for it since I'd really like to see one done right. If you're only going to go 95% of the way then please don't start.


    Lose Your Receipts


    Your car's records are a testament to it's real mileage and that you've kept it up . Save your receipts!


    Have Your Work Done by the Lowest Bidder


    Do you think I want to buy your car after you've cheaped out by taking it to the cheapest repair place you can find and used aftermarket parts? That tells me you spent as little as possible to keep your car running with no thought to the future.


    I always have my cars serviced at the dealer, so if you want a premium price for yours I'll expect you to have had it dealer serviced, too.


    Add Lots of Aftermarket Accessories


    Sure, bolt on those foglights and neon kits. Just do it so that you can take it off when you sell.


    SUMMARY


    if you can resist the temptation to screw with your car and keep it original you'll have a collectible in a decade or two. This is because every other turkey with a transportation car is out "improving" it, and after 10 years the most unique and unusual car will be yours, exactly like it left the factory.


    My 1988 Mercedes 190D was the bottom of the model line, not a 560 SL, and I still got top dollar for it. Most folks don't realize that collectiblity has more to do with condition than with model.


    When it comes to upgrades, just don't do it.

    FROM
    http://www.kenrockwell.com/bmw/collectible.htm

    Richard
    840 Ci Individual
    1995 factory CSi sport kit
    Ferrari 599 GT Red
    Hong Kong

  • Very interesting article. I think he's right when it comes to selling the car. Pardoxically, I love my car to much to leave it alone. I do intend to do some mods and upgrades. I figure the money spend on upgrading and the money you loose on the car being non-origanel is what you pay to have a hell of a lot of fun. Besides, I don't intend to sel the car anytime soon anyway. And if you stick to exhaust and rims, you can always get it back to its origanal form. It will cost money, but you can always sell your upgrade parts. Something like (upgrade parts + loss of originallity + original parts) - (sold upgrade parts + original car) = investment in fun.


    Cheers,


    Peter

  • I have to say that I dont agree. Despite what some people want to think, 8 series are not 'Classics' and probably never will be, certainly not in the next decade or so. They are great unusual cars to drive and look at.


    Not altering them from their original state, which in many cases are quite boring, is a kin to not installing the latest TV, cooker or other modern appliance to your house, just because you want to retain original features.


    Of course taste comes into it. You can do too much - look at Pimp My Ride etc, but you can improve your daily driving experience if you choose carefully things you actually want.


    Please fellow 8 owners, unless your car has less that 20K on the clock, and you keep in the garage for 45 weekends of the year, you will never own a classic car. It will just give you pleasure until it finally wears out. When sadly you'll get not much more that scrap for it.


    Enjoy 8s while you can, god in a decade or so spares wont be around anyway, and petrol will be 2.50 a litre :lol:

  • Some of the points the chap makes are valid but sometimes original parts and designs are crap and fail often so why not modify or modernise,why not use silicon plug leads or electronic ignition, luckily the 8 is a very modern design and build so not a lot needs doing, A lot of modifications are for your benefit like xenon lights why have 2 original lights like candles? At the end of the day the cars are mass produced and when old cheap,they aint never going to be worth that much,its true value is if you use it for many miles and many years then look back and say "I bought it 30 years ago it cost me x" by that time a new car will be X multiplied 500-
    sounds like the articles author couldnt afford new wheels :D

  • Given the large number of plastic painted parts on the car it's hard to see how they'd survive baking at ultra high temperatures mentioned?


    I agree, to a collector, originality is everything.


    I'm not a collector and won't be selling mine to a collector - they wouldn't want it!


    However, like most 8 buyers, I bought mine to enjoy. I have already made some modifications to it, very inexpensive, but they add to my enjoyment and hence the value of the car to me - which is what matters.
    Some folks don't like what I've done, that's OK too.
    If you want 24" ceramic brakes, it's your car and your money, so do it.
    If you want quadruple turbos, same goes.
    If you want a tartan paint job, same goes.


    I paid £8,500 to buy my 8 last year. As long as it doesn't depreciate any faster than a normal eurohatch I won't be too upset and can't imagine it ending up being worth nothing given its condition.


    I have commented before on a person who bought an 8 which was a colour he didn't like and had none of the options he wanted. He bought it purely because it had very very low miles and he planned it to be an investment. Of course he didn't drive it much - that would add miles.


    Again, if that's what you want to do, it's your money.


    We all have different likes, dislikes and aspirations for these cars.
    Long may this continue!

  • Sure, we all have our likes and dislikes. But, I've posted some pics somewhere else on this site showing what not to do with your 8. You can ruin it imho. I refuse to believe that for sake of subjectivity anything goes. Technically speaking it's much more simple. Rule of thumb is, when the performance improves it's a good mod. Aestetically, it's always save to stick to its original design. We do love the 8 for its smooth line and GT qualities, so changing that would make little sense anyway. I may be stepping on some toes here, sorry for that. But, that is my opinion.


    Cheers to all,


    Peter

  • Re: Article on why NOT to Upgrade your car


    Zitat von Richard.H


    Add Aftermarket DVD Navigation Systems, Radios or MP3 Players


    The people selling you your Pioneer DVD player or Alpine stereo take a lot of money from you and try to convince you you're upgrading. This may have been true in 1975, but not today. Today factory radios are the best head units you can get.


    This bit made me laugh. I guess this "collector" also doesn't want to clean out the dirt from his ears for fear that they'll become unoriginal :lol:


    I've yet to hear a factory radio that sounds anything other than crap. And that includes recent BMW "hi-fi" stuff. Some of the recent top end models are actually rebranded Alpine/Becker stuff, therefore probably far better than the usual stock junk, but those are few and far between.


    When I replaced the head unit in my 840, it made an amazing improvement to the sound, without touching the amp or speakers. Of course I still have the BMW radio that I can pop back in within 5 minutes come sale time, and let the new purchaser decide for himself whether factory radios are "the best you can get" 8)

  • Two Possibilites


    In my opinion there are a couple of possibilities;


    1/ The author is trying to convince you that an automobile is an investment (which it isn't), 2/ or he's off his meds and maybe a 3rd, his OBC is flaring up.


    If you own an Enzo or a Dino, keep it stock. Otherwise, a car is just a car. If it pleases you, mod it like crazy. It's all about passion. Mass produced cars rarely hold value, and the ones that do are unpredictable.


    Cars are generally rapidly depreciating machines. So what? I've got WAY more money in my 840 that I could ever recover in a sale. My 840, its been touched up, but its all original, except for the shocks and springs, which I can get factory originals if I really wanted to.


    All of it was money well spent. I can't put a price on the happiness that car has given me.


    There is absolutely nothing wrong with modding your car, but I think the author is correct that any car that will turn into a "Collector" will not get top dollar with mods, compared to one without.
    Just my 2 cents
    Have a great weekend

    Richard
    840 Ci Individual
    1995 factory CSi sport kit
    Ferrari 599 GT Red
    Hong Kong

  • I definitely agree with the bit about not replacing stereo units and not adding DVD players and TVs everywhere, other than that, it seems like this article is talking about cars that already have plans to be restored. I do know that if I had an 8, I would never sell it anyway :mrgreen:

  • Dylan


    Dylan
    Hi buddy - you're 17 years old now ...when do you plan to own your first 8 by? What is it about the 8 that inspires you

    Richard
    840 Ci Individual
    1995 factory CSi sport kit
    Ferrari 599 GT Red
    Hong Kong

  • The first time I saw the car, was five years ago, and I instantly fell in love with it. Since then, I've only seen two in real life. I've seen more Lamborghinis and Ferraris than that. Like many people, I thought it was some new top of the line BMW model (being that age I just thought "ooh! that's the highest number BMW I've seen!). I've always been one to want something unique, and this car is perfect in every way for me. I don't remember how much they were selling for when I first discovered it, but I remember thinking "oh, I'll never be able to afford that". But just recently I've started searching around and found that many cost less than the latest Toyota 4 cylinder, 4-door econobox.


    The things I really love about the car are all the electrics. I've always been into high tech things, and this car has it all. Power everything, the OBC, heated seats, power sunblind (though I've yet to see an 8 equipped with this for sale), and my favourite feature (for some reason), the four high beams :D . Oh and the size of the boot is perfect for my musical instruments (keyboards, bass saxophone).


    I'd really like to buy one before June, but I don't know if I'll have the funds by then, or if I'll be able to pay for the (costly from what I've read) maintenance/insurance.


    Well, I could go on for hours but I'll stop here for now :mrgreen:

  • The author of that article sound like he would buy beer and keep it unopened in the hopes that 50 year old Budweiser would command a premium :(


    Life is about living and cars are about driving :D

    It could be that the purpose of your life is only to serve as a warning to others. Mine sometimes feels that way.


    Terry


    1995 840Ci
    1991 850i
    Woodland Washington USA

  • I know the Ken Rockwell site from where that article comes from Ken is a professional photographer, who writes knowledgeale articles and reviews on cameras and lenses. He also likes cars...


    I think on the whole he is correct with regards to preserving the collectable value of a car. However, with regards to paintwork, I disagree. Firstly, the new water-based paints as used on the 8-series do require frequent maintenance to prevent stone chips from turning to rust. Of course, it would be good to maintain the original factory finish, but that just isn't possible with regular use. Additionally, the factory paint is not baked on at high temperatures and the electrostatic spraying mostly benefits the cavities and internal parts, which in most respray jobs are not touched any way. Possibly only the likes of Rolls Royce and Ferrari will apply several coats of paint to the body. The 8-series has a phospor dip, followed by a primer, base coat and clear lacquer (if metallic paint). The laquer is even only applied to exterior surfaces and internally, it stops with the primer. The early Mercedes 190s that he talks about still had the old type of solvent based paint-system, which was pretty much indestructible and easier to maintain in original condition.

  • I think this article comes from a guy who just watched the Barret-Jackson ego-inflation orgy where drunken rich guys just bid crazy amounts of money just so they can get on camera and brag to their buddies about it and how much they just spent on their latest HEEEEEMI! :roll:


    I'm 32, and I can say that it is most reasonable to conclude that as my generation grew up with cars that were more than quite shitty in their original condition, that we much prefer a well done tuned car over an all original with no guts. It is my beleif and the belief among most real enthusiasts that barret-Jackson is destroying the collector car market and this article is just another example as to why.

  • would you change the colour?




    Thanks - that being said would you change the paint colour from original?

    Richard
    840 Ci Individual
    1995 factory CSi sport kit
    Ferrari 599 GT Red
    Hong Kong

  • I wouldn't personally change the colour - it would cost an absolute fortune to do it properly.
    By properly I mean full stripout.
    It would be more sensible to try and find the right colour in the first place.


    If some rich guy decided he wanted one turning pink, I'd question his taste, question his judgement and wouldn't like or buy the end result. However, neither would I question his right to do it - and if it made him happy......


    If you look at my gallery you will see 5 non-BMW modifications.
    Of these, only the tail pipes are purely cosmetic. The rest have a function.
    They also add to my enjoyment of the car. I accept that others may hate what I've done.


    I agreed with the idea that collectors like originality. I still agree.
    I'm not a collector.

  • Changing the colour of the exterior is easy, but as UKZERO said, to do it properly, you would need to include the engine bay, the door pillars and all these other hard-to-get-at areas. So, no, I would not try it.

  • O.K.


    I was a child too when I saw the 8 first time, and sure I was freezed.
    Because, it was the only car that I saw (Still untill today) hold the road that tight and looks arround so wild.


    The main idea behind the modification(At least for me) I think,I couldn't able to buy one when it's first produced. Today they are at least 7-8 years old cars.


    I couldn't understand the madness of DVD players and hi-tech mods in an 8. But that doens't means I can not modify the rims or replace newer parts in it. Because when I'm in my 8 I feel my self like in early '90s.


    Form the other hand I do not believe; 8 series will be the collectable cars so far. Maybe for rear collectors but not in Generally. If we can keep them walking and really good walking ; that will be the prize of us.


    I always try to stay in original conditions but after 15 years if I had the possibility to own one ; That will be my play toy to drop something and replace new ones.


    And what will you drop and replace is ''Individual''


    Regards,
    Evren

  • Evren...your profile


    Your profile Evren says 270,000 kms- is that correct.
    Love the colour - what is it ?
    Thanks
    Great looking mods 8)8) Way cool :wink:

    Richard
    840 Ci Individual
    1995 factory CSi sport kit
    Ferrari 599 GT Red
    Hong Kong

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